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Official Next Smash - Speculation & Discussion Thread

Louie G.

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Speaking on cuts. This may be too ambitious but what if next game tried to tied a narrative around the cuts and replacement to soften the blow?

From the reveal of the new Smash, we have a villain character in the trailer who just murks all the cut characters in on fell swoop similar to the Ridley/Sephiroth/Galeem trailer but this time they are gone for good. Like snapped from the roster
This is a fun idea in theory, like it would make for a cool trailer, but I think it would have the inverse effect.

I'd personally feel pretty burned seeing some of my favorites like Little Mac or K. Rool for a split second before they get murdered and erased from existence, that feels taunting in a way that Smash is typically above. And it would probably just make a lot of people dislike the character who did it.
 
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Sucumbio

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I love still discovering things years into a game. So when did Meta Knight get his black costume with the blue gem on his sword? I never noticed! It's badass looking but I neither get the reference or remember if he's always had it or it was introduced last game or what...
 

Gorgonzales

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This is a fun idea in theory, like it would make for a cool trailer, but I think it would have the inverse effect.

I'd personally feel pretty burned seeing some of my favorites like Little Mac or K. Rool for a split second before they get murdered and erased from existence, that feels taunting in a way that Smash is typically above. And it would probably just make a lot of people dislike the character who did it.
I think having "people dislike the character who did it" is even more of a driving force to kick that villain's shins in. I actually love NabbitFan's idea, but I can absolutely see the community making it unbearable. Like, people going "Ha ha, you THOUGHT your character was coming back, but not anymore!! Everyone laugh at these guys!!" on social media.

In any scenario where Smash's fanbase had a maturity level above grade-schoolers, I could see this idea working really well and being engaging, especially with that ARG angle. But ironically, this is one of the things I wouldn't want solely because of the fanbase.
 

fogbadge

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I love still discovering things years into a game. So when did Meta Knight get his black costume with the blue gem on his sword? I never noticed! It's badass looking but I neither get the reference or remember if he's always had it or it was introduced last game or what...
the reference is it's based on Dark Meta Knight from kirby and the amazing mirror. although it more closely resembles the design from star allies
 

Louie G.

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Also feel like I need to share this phenomenal fan trailer / thread for Monster Hunter. It's already impressive on its own, but apparently the artist recreated SSBU in Unreal Engine just to make this work. Which unfortunately means this isn't a real mod, but it's one of the most convincing I've seen.

 

Nabbitfan730

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This is a fun idea in theory, like it would make for a cool trailer, but I think it would have the inverse effect.

I'd personally feel pretty burned seeing some of my favorites like Little Mac or K. Rool for a split second before they get murdered and erased from existence, that feels taunting in a way that Smash is typically above. And it would probably just make a lot of people dislike the character who did it.
Well yeah, that would be the point. The cost will still sting but it would used in constructive, interactive manner. It's in a similar manner how Villains are built in places like Professional Wresting. Seeing one character coming out of nowhere and destroying some of your favorites in ferocious manner for good this time would make a unique way to drum up excitement for the game via launch season.

Popular to hate and burning desire to defeat this one character. Possibly a secret character not revealed until launch or even a character that doesn't even have to playable themselves, could of the bosses in one the main adventure mode.

It's risky and out there but it could be possible. A way for Sakurai to bulid a narrative in similar philosophy used when he transitioned from SSE cut-scenes to Smash 4 trailers. Meta-like way to teach that the uncertainty and swift nature of "death" in a sense, that nothing truly last forever and even ones we "love" like those on the roster aren't untouchable and be taken at any time.

A bold contrast bouncing from EiH

but I can absolutely see the community making it unbearable. Like, people going "Ha ha, you THOUGHT your character was coming back, but not anymore!! Everyone laugh at these guys!!" on social media.
Social Media and Smash Fans reminding us why we can't have good things. Although ironically enough, i say the nature of social media could help bolden this idea.
 
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Gengar84

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Also feel like I need to share this phenomenal fan trailer / thread for Monster Hunter. It's already impressive on its own, but apparently the artist recreated SSBU in Unreal Engine just to make this work. Which unfortunately means this isn't a real mod, but it's one of the most convincing I've seen.

That is a really cool trailer. The moveset looks like it would be a lot of fun too. Too bad Ultimate moveset mods aren’t quite at that level yet because I’d love to try something like this.
 

Nabbitfan730

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Having one character butt in and kill your favorite guys with no way to get them back would not build excitement it would incite riots.
Would be funny at first. I mean sooner or later, they have to rip the band-aid someday so why do with a bang.

Too ambitous maybe but still
 

Gengar84

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Drawing attention to the characters that don't make the cut is an absolutely terrible idea.
Especially if those characters are third party. I have a hard time seeing a third party developer signing off just to let Smash kill their character in a cutscene. Seems like that would be a hard sell and it would probably upset a lot of fans. People were already upset enough about Sakurai’s comments when revealing Waluigi was returning as an assist trophy or Chrom’s “I’ll get a chance another day”. I feel like the reaction to this would probably be worse.
 
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KingofPhantoms

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The idea of a new villain/adventure mode boss wiping our characters who were playable in prior installments but not the latest one absolutely works on paper, but in practice it might not really work out for the best.

If people still react to cuts as negatively as they did back in Smash 4 (I saw people say absolutely horrible things about Sakurai and the other developers for several of the character cuts back when the final pre-DLC roster was confirmed via leaks, and IIRC this was before any DLC was announced), some of whom may have even been beyond their control at the time), then they'll likely still react to them with severe toxicity to cuts again.

Ultimate's existence is likely going to soften the blow this time, but even then, making a meta move like having a villain wipe out every cut character is likely going to garner mixed reactions from people at best.
 

DarthEnderX

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27e: Morpho Knight
The way the Kirby knights should be organized is:
27: Meta Knight with Dark Meta Knight alts
27e: Galacta Knight with Morpho Knight alts

Meta Knight and Galacta Knight are two completely different characters. But Galacta Knight and Morpho Knight are the same character.

I'm even more unsure as to what the next new Smash game might be called considering that Smash 4 didn't even really have a proper new title.
Smash Slobberknocker
 
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Louie G.

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Especially if those characters are third party. I have a hard time seeing a third party developer signing off just to let Smash kill their character in a cutscene.
For what it's worth I agree, since they wouldn't be playable so what would be the point, but I can't help but think about the third parties that got wiped by Galeem, throttled by Sephiroth, Mega Man got impaled by Ridley and of course we got this fantastic piece of art with Kazuya.



Which, if anything, I would just say is a testament to which third parties are the most cooperative. Capcom letting Ryu straight up lose to Kazuya here, essentially one of Street Fighter's market "rivals", is a particular kind of generosity you wouldn't expect from most. Sega and Konami are notable mentions for being featured in both the World of Light and Sephiroth trailers too.
 
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HyperSomari64

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Super Smash Bros: Infinite sounds cool especially if they plan to support it for an extended period of time through DLC.
There is a creation thread with that name, now with it's expansion Infinite Beyond.
 

Noipoi

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For what it's worth I agree, since they wouldn't be playable so what would be the point, but I can't help but think about the third parties that got wiped by Galeem, throttled by Sephiroth, Mega Man got impaled by Ridley and of course we got this fantastic piece of art with Kazuya.



Which, if anything, I would just say is a testament to which third parties are the most cooperative. Capcom letting Ryu straight up lose to Kazuya here, essentially one of Street Fighter's market "rivals", is a particular kind of generosity you wouldn't expect from most. Sega and Konami are notable mentions for being featured in both the World of Light and Sephiroth trailers too.
You make a good point. However, I’d argue that all those defeats you mentioned were “temporary”.

No matter how brutal the scene may be, we all know Mega Man isn’t dead forever. We all know Galeem won’t permanently destroy these guys. It would be entirely different to license all these characters just to have them be irreversibly annihilated, and not be part of the game.

Not disagreeing with you, just adding to your point :nifty:
 

Gengar84

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The way the Kirby knights should be organized is:
27: Meta Knight with Dark Meta Knight alts
27e: Galacta Knight with Morpho Knight alts

Meta Knight and Galacta Knight are two completely different characters. But Galacta Knight and Morpho Knight are the same character.
The way Smash handles echoes and alts currently feels so random. Dr. Mario gets his own slot and he’s literally just Mario in a different costume but Alph has to share a slot with Olimar. I’m okay with either approach, I just wish there was a bit more consistency. Same with the distinction of which characters are labeled as echoes versus clones/semiclones.
 
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PF9

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I also want all the non-human mammals to have fur textures in their designs even Pikachu.
 

Gengar84

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I also want all the non-human mammals to have fur textures in their designs even Pikachu.
Yeah that would be cool. I think Pikachu actually got a fur texture in Scarlet and Violet so there’s a decent chance for that. It also had fur in the Detective Pikachu movie.
 

Louie G.

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Not disagreeing with you, just adding to your point :nifty:
Yeah, I think I just wanted to bring attention back to which characters and companies get the most spotlights in cutscenes / trailers / promo and how that's a testament to the level of trust they have in Sakurai and Co. Like, Mega Man just frequently appearing alongside Nintendo characters like it's nothing solidified the idea that he's an essential component of the series for me. And Banjo appearing in Sephiroth's trailer next to Sonic and Inkling made me feel a bit warm and fuzzy inside... I'm not even a diehard Banjo fan or anything, it's just cool to see characters welcomed into the fold like that.

What's surprising to me is how little Pac-Man has appeared, I wonder what the deal is with that. He's obviously as safe as can be, but I wonder if there's something conditional holding him back from appearing in other trailers. He did show up in that one CG Smash Ultimate ad, although it was as a moving png compared to Sonic and Mega Man being properly animated. You'd think we would at least see him pop up in the World of Light intro.
 
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fogbadge

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Friendly reminder that Kirby was the only one to survive Kazuya's onslaught entirely and didn't even temporarily die.
I don’t think anything in that trailer suggests he was the one who actually beat them. he could have just been cleaning up after the sephiroth trailer
 

Nabbitfan730

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Especially if those characters are third party. I have a hard time seeing a third party developer signing off just to let Smash kill their character in a cutscene. Seems like that would be a hard sell and it would probably upset a lot of fans. People were already upset enough about Sakurai’s comments when revealing Waluigi was returning as an assist trophy or Chrom’s “I’ll get a chance another day”. I feel like the reaction to this would probably be worse.
They didn't mind when Ridley killed Mega Man, nor when Galeem wiped the stale clean or when Sephiroth did the same thing. Even then majority of cuts seen would mostly from Nintendo catalogue anyways due from larger ratio

If people still react to cuts as negatively as they did back in Smash 4 (I saw people say absolutely horrible things about Sakurai and the other developers for several of the character cuts back when the final pre-DLC roster was confirmed via leaks, and IIRC this was before any DLC was announced), some of whom may have even been beyond their control at the time), then they'll likely still react to them with severe toxicity to cuts again.
Smash Fans are going to be toxic and nasty no matter what. That's the unfortunately inevitable. Everyone was Here and even then some for Ultimate and there you can argue the toxicity was at its worst due to sheer scale.

The idea is meant to be bold way in easing a controversial inevitability, it isn't going to please everyone. When was the latter ever possible with Smash?

So because fans will get angry like usual, we shouldn't do anything ever? People are going to be upset with cuts regardless, why not have them go out with style?
 
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Noipoi

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They didn't mind when Ridley killed Mega Man, nor when Galeem wiped the stale clean or when Sephiroth did the same thing.
Those characters weren’t permanently dead though. It’s like a game over in a video game, you know they’re gonna get right back up again.

It’d be totally different to just completely “kill off” those characters.
 

Nabbitfan730

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Those characters weren’t permanently dead though. It’s like a game over in a video game, you know they’re gonna get right back up again.

It’d be totally different to just completely “kill off” those characters.
They aren't dead here either, just cut

You are delusional if you think showing characters being killed off and being scrapped from the roster will ease anything.

That isn't "going out with style", that's literally adding insult to injury.
All the reason to want to beat this guy in Smash. Also the injury is as deep as you make it.

Also i hope you mean by "kill" i mean the kill you see in Smash like the silver explosion and not some graphic affair.
 
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